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Applications that Shouldn't be Repackaged

R-Vijay's picture

Existing MSI packages should be deployed as they are. If customization is necessary, a Transform (MST) file should be used to introduce that customization. If you repackage an application and find that it references the MSI.DLL file, it is better not to repackage the application. Microsoft Office 2000 and XP are good examples. These applications are hard coded to use the Windows Installer service, and may make calls back to certain locations within the original MSI package.

Applications containing system files managed by the Windows File Protection features of Windows 2000 and later are also to be avoided, such as Internet Explorer, Windows Service Packs and certain hot fixes. For these, a provided MSI or command line installation is your best bet.

Repackaging certain types of applications is not recommended. These include:

  1. MSI files. Installations that are already in .MSI format should not be repackaged, but instead should be customized using a "transform." A transform customizes an .MSI installation without recreating it from scratch.
  2. Transforms are applied at install time and are used to change the default behavior of the installation. The original .MSI file is needed in order to create a transform.
  3. Operating systems. Capturing is not appropriate for operating systems or service patches.
  4. Windows Media Player, Microsoft Internet Explorer, anti-virus software, and device drivers. All four types of applications listed make low-level changes to the operating system involving Windows File Protection.

Why don't we usually repackage an MSI?

First of all, MSI installations are already in a in a distributable format, so there is no benefit to recreating the setup. MSI packages are full of internal references, which cannot be captured and recreated. These internal references are critical to the self-healing functionality of MSI packages and are fundamental to their operation. Repackaging an MSI may result in uninstall problems and other Windows Installer related problems.

Finally, and perhaps most important, when the vendor releases and update or patch (MSP) for the product, it will be designed to update their MSI and not yours. When repackaging, all of the globally unique identifiers (GUIDs) used to identify items in the package are regenerated and will not match up to the updates provided by the software vendor package. There are no changes that cannot be implemented at install-time using an MST (transform) file. Aside from dictating installation preferences, you can add, delete or change any items you wish.

R-Vijay's picture

Service Packs

Microsoft uses a different packaging technology to create Service Packs and other updates for many products, including Windows, Internet Explorer, Exchange Server, SQL Server and ISA Server. This technology is not related to the Windows installer and it is completely unsupported to convert the updates to Installer packages. Refer to the following article for support details:

You may be aware that Windows Service Packs ship with an “Update.msi” package that can be used to deploy the Service Pack via Group Policy. This package simply calls the normal .exe-based install as a custom action. This is the only supported use of this package and it is not supported to create your own similar MSI wrapper for Service Packs or other updates. Apart from the one situation mentioned, deploying updates in this way is not tested by Microsoft and the results cannot be guaranteed and hence are unsupported.

Microsoft MVP [Setup-Deploy]
Weblog: www.msigeek.com

Harsh's picture

wrapper MSI

If we want to give MSI Solution then we can create wrapper MSI for these executables.
I mean we can wrapped Windows Media Player, anti-virus software, unsigned device drivers into MSI for installation and uninstallation. Thats the only way for MSI packaging.

The VBScripts can be alternative deployment solution for such applications. You can call exe silently in VBscript. and then these VBscripts can be deploy using some deployment tools.

For Signed device drivers you can create MSI using DIFX merge module.

Thanks
Harsh M.

ropree's picture

Wrapper MSI

Hi Harsh,

I am new at WISE packaging. I am packaging Adobe Acrobat Pro 8. I used Adobe's wizard to create a tranform file based on the existing .msi for the installation.

My IT department is looking for a "wrapper" MSI. IT techs don't want to run an .exe which contains .msi and .mst to install the app. They want one file .msi.

Is this possible? I have not seen an option in WISE package studio 7 standard ed.

Thanks,
Ropree

Harsh's picture

vendor MSI

Adobe Acrobat Pro 8 must be Vendor MSI, It will get extcated when you double click on Setup.exe.

Instead of creating transform, you can directly edit it in Wise Package studio and save it as MSI.

Replied to your persnal mail. Check it if that suffice, revert back if you have any more query.

Thanks
Harsh M.

R-Vijay's picture

One solution for your case

One solution for your case would be, (though its not ethical)

Create a dummy MSI, add adobe msi and mst in temp folder of your MSI, write a nested CA to call a second instance of msiexec process and run this in a custom action.

Hope this helps.

We are figuring out a procedure to do the same using wrapper. Gimme sometime and I will revert back with the wrapper instructions for acrobat.

CHeers'
Vijay Raj

Microsoft MVP [Setup-Deploy]
Weblog: www.msigeek.com

AngelD's picture

Update nested MSI not possible

Have in mind that it's not possible to update an nested MSI therefore not recommended. In fact; nested installations are not recommended at all, not even from Microsoft.

For vendor packages I would suggest the best way is to use a transform. How ever, sometimes you need to bend and/or break the rules and modify or repackage the vendor MSI from some time to time.

R-Vijay's picture

Nested MSI calls in not ethical

Yes Angel,
I agree with you that, Nested MSI calls in not recommended. That was why I mentioned it as not ethical there.

However, as this requirement specifies, we will need a MSI which calls a combination of MSI and MST.
Best answer for this would be to write a CMD file call that in a package.

This CMD file will further take care of the installation.

Microsoft MVP [Setup-Deploy]
Weblog: www.msigeek.com

ropree's picture

MSI and MST to create EXE

Hey everyone...
I figured out how to create an EXE which combines bothe MSI and MST. Email me directly if you would like the document.

Also, I was thinking about "editting" the vendor MSI to create an MSI but with Acrobat and it's licensing way, I did not see it "do-able."

Thanks,
Ropree

R-Vijay's picture

That's Cool !!!

Good to know that the problem with Acrobat is solved. Many of my team-mates were struggling a lot with it and alas we wrapped to make it work.

I was figuring out a solution MSI which invokes a cmd file to install the MSI and MST.

Please do share the document for my reference too.. :)

Cheers;
Vijay Raj

Microsoft MVP [Setup-Deploy]
Weblog: www.msigeek.com

ropree's picture

MSI and MST

Hi Viju,

My real name is Panna Patel...

Anyhow, where should I send the document? I am new at JUICE.

Also, I wanted to post a question on Dreamweaver packaging, do you know where / how I can start a new post?

Thanks,
Pp.

erikw's picture

New post about dreamweaver packaging

You can start a new post with create new content. If you choose the wrong thread the guy's from the juice will place it correct.
About dreamweaver packaging.
If you wish to package adobe CS3 with dreamweaver, then you can now stop it. It will not work.
However it can be doen in SVS. I already submitted a article about it, but it is not yet visible on the juice.

Regards
Erik
www.svs4u.nl

Regards
Erik
www.DinamiQs.com
Dinamiqs is the home of VirtualStorm (www.virtualstorm.org)

ropree's picture

Dreamweaver CS3 - I need it packaged

Hi Erik,

So what if we don't have SVS? I need this packaged and WPS is giving errors during packing the EXE and they don't have an MSI (at least and MSI that I can see).

Any suggestions will help.

erikw's picture

Adobe CS 3

Ropree,

I can not help you further. For one of our customers we have tried to package it with Softgrid. No success.
We then tried it with Wise package studio. Again no success.

Editing the XML files in it helped us to get it installed on Windows 2003 server, because Adobe is not supporting that.
The only way to get a package that works is to bring it into SVS.
If anyone has another way doing it, please feel free to let me know, but as i love SVS i packaged it with it, and then deployed it with DVS4SBC on the Citrix server.
It works great.

Regards
Erik
www.svs4u.nl

Regards
Erik
www.DinamiQs.com
Dinamiqs is the home of VirtualStorm (www.virtualstorm.org)

erikw's picture

The solution for Ropree

Get smart, and buy a couple of SVS licenses. That is the easiest way around, and for the price you don't have to leave it.

Regards
Erik
www.svs4u.nl

Regards
Erik
www.DinamiQs.com
Dinamiqs is the home of VirtualStorm (www.virtualstorm.org)

R-Vijay's picture

DreamWeaver cs3 packaging in Wise

Hi Panna..

Can I answer your query???? :)

If your environment and your customers are not with SVS, then you can wrap this setup.exe again into a msi using wise package studio.

Steps:

Call this setup.exe in a custom action in deferred sequence under system context. Use /silent or any switch to hide the GUI of setup instructions.

Now, if you have any customizations to be done.., then you will need a VBScript to make the changes.

For eg: The shortcut should be in a seperate menu.
Use a VBSCript to move the menu item form StartMenu->ProgramsMenufolder to your desired one.

These steps can be followed, if at all you have a constraint to package it using WPS.

As erik says, you can also look at the solution throug SVS. I havent got my hands yet on that.. :)

Hope it is helpful.

Cheers'
Viju

Microsoft MVP [Setup-Deploy]
Weblog: www.msigeek.com

R-Vijay's picture

Starting a new post..

Hi Panna,

Sorry for addressing you Ropree in my previos msges. he he...!!! :)

As Erik said, You can start a new post with the otion "create new content". Juicemaster will place it correct in the questions dialog. Further, the juice master also takes care about giving a proper subject line for our article or tech-tip.
You can enter it here..
http://juice.altiris.com/node/add/tip

It would be great if you could mail me the document to vijayraj.vm@gmail.com.

Thanks in advance.

Cheers'
Viju

Microsoft MVP [Setup-Deploy]
Weblog: www.msigeek.com

ropree's picture

Dreamweaver CS3 Packaging...

Thank you for the information on Posting as well as Dreamweaver packaging.

Okay so from SVS stems a question...if I have WISE Studio Packaging 7.0 Standard, can I use Virtualization?

Thanks,
Panna

erikw's picture

Yes you cann

With Wise 7 standard you cann start packaging for SVS, but Adobe suite CS 3 you can't, because it is simply to big.
You can use svs packaging in SVS for that.

Regards
Erik
www.svs4u.nl

Regards
Erik
www.DinamiQs.com
Dinamiqs is the home of VirtualStorm (www.virtualstorm.org)

R-Vijay's picture

Option to SVS

Hi Erik,

Can you explain the process of SVS in WPS 7.0 ?
Further, from a standard user perspective..whats the main advantage of using SVS?

Cheers'
Viju

Microsoft MVP [Setup-Deploy]
Weblog: www.msigeek.com

erikw's picture

I cannot believe

Viju,

I cannot believe that you never used SVS.
Please download it and get using it. It will cheer you up.

Regards
Erik
www.svs4u.nl

Regards
Erik
www.DinamiQs.com
Dinamiqs is the home of VirtualStorm (www.virtualstorm.org)

Jordan's picture

Does WPS give you access to

Does WPS give you access to SVScomand? if so you can just exec CMD.exe from a layer and run a capture--it's the only way I've gotten CS3 to work.

If a forum post solves your problem please flag is as the solution

I you like an article, blog post or download vote it up

erikw's picture

Yes it does

WPS gives u access to the SVScommand, and you can use that.
But still it will become a VSA, and that is not what Ropree wants.
I see no other posibillity than to edit the XML, or buy SVS
Regards
Erik
www.svs4u.nl

Regards
Erik
www.DinamiQs.com
Dinamiqs is the home of VirtualStorm (www.virtualstorm.org)

R-Vijay's picture

CS2 installation using Command line

FYI

If it's anything like CS2 - run setup.exe -r, go through the dialogs with the required responses, locate and copy the setup.iss file created in the windows folder, then install using setup.exe -s -f1\setup.iss

Cheers'
Viju

Microsoft MVP [Setup-Deploy]
Weblog: www.msigeek.com

txpcgirle's picture

Dreamweaver

I'm having simular issues with Dreamweaver. I found this which has at the very least helped me understand the installation process and it has the VBscript for installing. I hope it helps.

http://www.appdeploy.com/packages/detail.asp?id=1040

altiris_user11's picture

Nice

That is very cool. Could you please send me the document. Thanks

WiseUser's picture

Adobe CS3

I Believe the adobe Suite Cs3 is a vendor msi by itself and we can use the .xml files to install silently .

Install Cmd : Setup.exe" --mode=silent --deploymentFile="%CD%\deployment\install.xml

Uninstall Cmd : Setup.exe" --mode=silent --deploymentFile="%CD%\deployment\uninstall.xml"

Wiseuser
Altiris Certified Professional

tfronza's picture

Never Modified XML files

I can't say I have ever modified XML files to do a Silent install can you give me a little more information on this one??? I think it could be handy for installing any Adobe product as we have what seems like all of them in our environment!

Thanks
Tom Fronza
State of Ohio
Dept. of Taxation

R-Vijay's picture

Looks impressive..

Hi.. This xml technique looks really very impressive.
Can you please share some more information on this?

Cheers'
Viju

Microsoft MVP [Setup-Deploy]
Weblog: www.msigeek.com

WiseUser's picture

Latest Adobe through XML

I have posted a seperate article on how to play with xml files for the adobe installation..Hope it helps..

Wiseuser
Altiris Certified Professional