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Moving Deleted Items

Created: 28 Oct 2012 | 9 comments

Hi, I'm using EV10 SP1, Outlook 2010, Exchange 2010, outlook add-in Sp2.  I'm moving items from my Deleted Items to my virtual vault. 

1. If the target is a sub folder in VV then I get a popup saying it could take some time to move items but nothing actually happens, I believe due to calendar items being present.  It seems to do a scan of all the items and if a calendar item is present, since we do not archive them, it won't move anything. (One user tried to move 44,000 items from Deleted Items but his Outlook locked up, trying to scan them all I think).

2. If the target is Deleted Items in the VV, then I get the copying status window appear and all items are moved, apart from calendar items which trigger a popup saying I cannot move items due to policy restrictions.  All items are moved apart from calendar items.

Why the distinction between Deleted Items being the target folder and any other folder?

Thanks.

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RahulG's picture

Deleted item folser is linked to the Dumpster, and you need to have the hard delete option truned on in the policy , because if you you dont have the option set, then when you delete the item from virtual vault , the item would sit in the deleted items folder which might cause mailbox quota issue.

 

Deletig an item in Outlook and  VV moves  the existing folder to the Deleted Items folder and is controled  by the Advanced VV desktop policy "Users can reorganize items".

When you empty deleted items or do a Shift-Delete of an item in any other folder Outlook does a hard delete of the item, that translates (in VV) to deleting the item in the archive on the next sync. For this you need the Advanced VV desktop policy  "Users can hard delete items" and the site must allow users to delete items. The behaviour you describe would seem to imply that the delete policy is not getting through to the client. The Enterprise Vault Information text would help confirm if this is the case.

Sortid's picture

Hi Rahul, the issue is with moving items FROM my mailbox TO virtual vault.  If the items in the Deleted items has a calendar acceptance there it won't move anything unless the target is the Deleted Items folder in my virtual vault.  Moving items to any other folder in VV seems to scan all the items first and if it finds something it can't archive it rejects all the messages, whereas moving to the deleted items folder tries each item in turn and only those that can't be moved are left behind. 

I do have hard deletes and organise items enabled in the policy btw.  We also don't use shortcuts.

Thanks.

JesusWept3's picture

to be honest if you try to do anything that has that many items in outlook you will find it becomes "unresponsive", it not only has to add the items in to VV but it also has to update exchange saying the items have been deleted and also has to remove it from the outlook cache itself, so you have three operations going all at once, two of which cause disk contention issues.

If its a regular laptop or even a desktop, you probably have a 7,200RPM disk where the OST and the VC DB files are all on the same drive, add in some disk fragmentation, and possibly Anti-Virus scanning on the outlook side and also on the file system and things will naturally just bog down.

Your best bet maybe to evpm the user to a 0 day archival on \Deleted Items then do a run now through the archive task and then have the user sync down their virtual vault.

Another reason for doing this is with those disk contention issues and the large amount of items, you could risk corrupting the vault cache, and then it can't sync up the items that are awaiting to upload... meaning you have to recover the items from the dumpster, and if you don't have exchange dumpster enabled, it could mean dataloss

Sortid's picture

Did I say 44,000 items?  Oops, I meant 4,000.  He has an SSD HDD which is why I found it interesting that it froze for over 20mins which we ended up killing.  I guess I want to know why I can't move items to any folder apart from Deleted Items if I have calendar items in them.  In one test I had only 3 items one of which is a calendar item.  The only place it lets me move them is Deleted Items (leaving the Calendar item behind), and i get errors if I repeat the test to any other VV folder.

With the user with 4000 items, we dumped them into the Deleted Items in VV.  It copied 3000 items in a few mins to the VV then it stopped.  We had to attempt to copy the other 1000 items repeatedly as it was like a local limit had been reached of the amount to copy over and it had to clear the queue, if you know what i mean.  Subsequent copies would do 20 or so at a time.  We left it for a while then did the rest at once. 

Rob.Wilcox's picture

So in a test that I just did ...

 

I have those 4 items, one of which is a meeting request, and I dragged and dropped them to the inbox.

 

No problem.

 

Maybe it's related to this setting in your policy?

If I've misunderstood your test/question, please restate it, and / or screenshot it :)

 

PS I don't think it is related to what you 'allow' to be archived or not..  a user can manually archive anything, unless you have the ManualArchiveMessageClassCheck registry key in place.

Sortid's picture

Hi Rob, the items I am attempting to move are located in Deleted Items in my Mailbox, and are not in the vault.  We don't archive calendar items. 

If you don't have that reg key set, it's true a user can click Store to put them in the archive, but they cannot drag and drop in VV.  Setting that reg key disables the store function.

Thanks,

Rob.Wilcox's picture

Okay I have 3 regular items, and one calendar item in my deleted items folder in my mailbox.

 

If I drag and drop all 4 of those items to Inbox, or a Subfolder of Inbox, or Sent Items in Virtual Vault .. SOME of the items are moved.  But then I get a pop-up saying:

 

Cannot move the items.  You cannot copy or move the selected items into Virtual Vault.

You have selected a type of item that your organization's archiving policy does not allow you to archive.

 

So, I don't see the problem with that?  Other than the fact that a 'random' number do get moved before it's stopped and you get the pop-up.  It would be nice if either:

 

a/  All items EXCEPT those violating the policy were moved... leaving me with the ones that are breaking the archiving rules

b/  None of the items were moved, and it told me which messages should be excluded.

 

Also as you pointed out, if the target folder is the deleted items folder in VV, then ALL the items appear to be moved, apart from the calendar item(s)

 

Is that what you're seeing then?

 

I also tried MOVING 6000 items from one folder to another inside Virtual Vault, and it worked just fine.

Sortid's picture

Ok, that's different to what I get.  When I copy to any other folder I get the message saying "Microsoft Outlook: Creating a new items from the selected items could take some time. Are you sure you want to create a new items from these 4 items" then when you click yes it doesn't do anything.  If I move them to Deleted Items in VV it moves all apart from calendar items. 

I just realised what that said...when I click yes, it pops up an email message asking for a recipient, but I was clicking it away thinking it was a calendar item issue or something.  It was actually combining the contents of all the messages into one big one.  I put in me as the recipient and it sent it to my inbox.  Still didn't delete anything from Deleted Items nor move anything to the VV.

Gaaaah!   Where's the policy which sets this behaviour?!

Sortid's picture

So according to Google, if you move calendar items anywhere in your mailbox it attempts to combine all the messages into one item (http://support.microsoft.com/kb/2176998).  This is true if you move them to VV, unless the target is Deleted Items in VV for some reason (which I don't understand why).  I've noticed it only does this when IPM.Appointment items are in the list.  IPM.Schedule seems to work normally.  Can you test that Rob?

Thanks.